March 28, 2007
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Doubting Calvinists and Agnostics — Is there any difference?
A dialogue showing there is no difference between a Doubting Calvinist (a Calvinist doubting their salvation) and an Atheist/Agnostic (a skeptic doubting their salvation)
AGNOSTIC: So you think I’m in a dangerous situation, do you?DOUBTING CALVINIST: Yes, I do. And I’m praying that God will bring you out of it.
Agnostic:
OK, I admit that I know nothing about what is going to happen to me
after death. I may be happy. I may be miserable. I may be neither.
Indeed, to me it’s all a matter of doubt and uncertainty.Doubting Calvinist: I pity you from the bottom of my heart.
Agnostic:
Of course, you must have a comfortable state of mind. You must be
triumphing in the hope of the glory that awaits you when you leave this
world.Doubting Calvinist: Well … I think I have a good hope through grace … I do hope I shall be happy after death.
Agnostic:
Wait a second! It sounds like you are saying that you are not actually
confident respecting your destination after death. Do you mean to say
that you are not absolutely certain of being happy after death? It
seems that you have some doubts about your eternity!Doubting
Calvinist: Well… I think that I have a well grounded hope. It seems
the Spirit has worked in me. But I can’t be presumptuous. It’s not
humble for a Christian to speak presumptuously about being elect.Agnostic.
Can you please talk straight? Are you certain that you shall be happy
after death? Or are there some doubts in your mind?Doubting
Calvinist: Well … I can’t say that I am absolutely certain. All I can
say is that if I persevere I will get to heaven.Agnostic.
Then let us be friends! Or should i say “brother skeptics”! Why should
you and I quarrel about our views? From what you have just said, it’s
clear that there is barely a difference between our positions. It’s
really only semantics. I’m without religion and confess that I am
uncertain about my future. And you with your religion are also
uncertain about your future. We’re both uncertain about our future. Surely, if we are
both skeptical about our futures after death, we don’t have much to
disagree about!(There is no difference between a Doubting Calvinist and an Agnostic)
Comments (4)
You’ve proved that both are doubting, but that much was known based on the labels for them, wasn’t it?
You shouldn’t add atheists to that list of people. I know God doesn’t exist and reject the concept because it is a horrible evil concept. Jesus Christ was not even a good person. He loved the weak because they were weak and the misfortunate because of their misfortune. He had no values.
I noticed your comment on my brother’s (XristosAnesti) page, and I was curious so I came to see your posts. In response to your conclusion, i would say there is one VERY important difference between the two people you described. The doubting Calvinist is elect, and the doubting agnostic is not! Your aguments seem to make sense logically at first, but I would challange your conclusions. I have never met a Christian who constantly doubts that God exists or that He is good, but ALL Christians I have met (if they are truly honest with themselves) have at one time or another experienced SOME doubt for a time. On the otherhand, unbelievers live day in and day out with either doubts or outright rejection of the truth of the gospel. They do not have ANY times when they are absolutely certain of what they believe. I think it is important to remember that we ARE sinful, fallen human beings, and are NOT perfect. But the Holy Spirit is pushing us toward perfection, which we will not attain until we are with the Father in heaven. Doubt is as much a symptom of our fallenness as greed, and hatered, and malice, and lies, and lust, and any other sin (which, by the way, are in many lists of things that will keep you out of heaven…yet no one argues that Christians are without those shortcomings.) In the end it is only the grace of God that saves us, and it is only the Holy Spirit that assures us of our salvation. Christians can doubt and can ask the hard questions, but the difference is that they will always find the answer in the loving arms of Christ, while unbelievers will never find satisfactory answers.
I hope that made some sense
Interesting. Seeing that you seem to be interested in these spiritual matters, maybe you’d care to take part in a little spiritual/philosophical dialog I’m trying to get going? Well either way, I wish you the best of luck on your spiritual journey!